We haven't posted any updates on our blog in quite a while aside from the Jira outage earlier today :( So I felt I should just give you all an update on why we have been so quiet.
We've been so quiet because we've been extremely busy getting Firestorm to an 'Official Release' state! That's right! It's coming soon and we're very excited about it, I know I certainly am! Of course, we are still quite concerned about the GL(Graphics) issues that surfaced with mesh from LL. We're watching LL's progress on those very closely, testing and pulling in as many functioning fixes as we can. As of yesterday Firestorm development shifted into release mode. This means we are now focused on fixing the significant remaining bugs, polishing up any unfinished features that have been in progress and we've started an intense QA program. If all goes well, the next release of Firestorm will be the big one! So everyone is now going to want to know when will it be released. Unfortunately it seems every time we announce a date.. something goes wrong to jinx it, so I won't go down that path, but I will say.. VERY SOON!
Firestorm will be going out with some fantastic new features as well as some really significant bug fixes. Features like Mesh upload!, Right click> texture refresh for those stubborn textures that refuse to load, or avatars who remain grey or blurry! Spell check, Chat bar auto hide (v1 behavior), Automatic spam protection, WindLight day/night slider in quick preferences, invite to group from profile and SO MUCH MORE! And bugs?! Wow! we've stomped out loads of bugs! Inventory jumping issues will be mostly a thing of the past, a fix for folders that land outside your main inventory folder, Windlight settings that save between sessions and the list goes on and on!
Of course, I suspect the next big question will be "But what about Phoenix with mesh?". Well, that's right around the corner too! We hope to be able to release it a couple weeks after this next Firestorm Release. This means that within a few weeks, the vast majority of SL users will be on mesh capable viewers! So all you mesh creators can get busy working on your magical mesh creations with the knowledge and confidence that it WILL be adopted!
We've been quiet... But not because we haven't been working! We are all really looking forward to bringing you the best Firestorm Release to date AND Phoenix with Mesh support very soon after!
Stay tuned!
Jessica Lyon
The Phoenix Viewer Project, Inc.
will phoenix have the new shiny and shadows that run like they do on cool veiwer?
ReplyDeleteYou should include the new UI that LL has on its 3.2.1 developer viewers too.
ReplyDeleteOnly care about Phoenix with mesh at the moment, with the brainiacs at LL doing a revamp of their release viewer I am wondering just how that is going to effect the Firestorm release and functionality down the road. Maybe they finally figured out they need to fix that disaster UI.
ReplyDeleteI hope Firestorm will also have the auto response feature that Phoenix has, as long as that is not the case, I won't even give it a shot. I can't do without it anymore.
ReplyDelete"Right click> texture refresh for those stubborn textures that refuse to load, or avatars who remain grey or blurry! Spell check"...\o/ Winning! Currently I am on Phoenix. I gave Firestorm with mesh a shot but..oh my gosh...It ran so slow! Textures took forever to load, if they would at all for me :((((...Hopefully by the official Fstorm release, I wont have that problem, as well as having the ability to fix those really stubbern textures that won't load from time to time. \o/ I'm excited!
ReplyDeleteGood to hear Phoenix is being update this is because Firestorm does not have the FLYCAM Indicator for my SpaceNavigator so I have to use Phoenix.
ReplyDeleteAre Linux users going to be able to install this if they haven't got the very latest version of their operating system?
ReplyDeleteI wonder if the new FS will use the new UI LL just released in their development viewer 3.2.1
ReplyDeleteIt runs smoothly and it removed the sidebar that phoenix community hated.
I tested that viewer and is seems pretty good. Of course it misses the firestorm features (temporary textures in example for me is a need also if i seen the LL approach to it and it will be very good when it will work).
I must empathise with Maggy regarding the Phoenix-style autoresponse feature. I really enjoyed having separate messages for busy mode and away; shoving them both into an "unavailable" mode really kills the flexibility.
ReplyDeleteThough it's not a deal breaker for me by any means - all I *really* miss is spell check anyway!
One pedantic (small) nag though: I miss having volume controls on the bottom. But ah well, everything else makes even that worthwhile.
With any luck those two things will be included in that "..and much much more" bit. All I know is I'm loving FS now, especially since it actually runs a bit smoother on my ageing machine than Phoenix.
Thank you for the good and hard work, the progress is visible on the JIRA!
ReplyDelete(at least the bug squashing progress^^).
I honestly hope the new release of Firestorm includes a feature that phoenix has: it tells you if the avatar is in the sim or not directly from the list of objects in the About Land window, that simple thing makes management incredibly easier (in particular when you manage a busy place like a sandbox), I just only hope!
Can't wait for the next release =D
I am just hoping the release will make the viewer run more smoothly. I hated getting such laggy frame rates.
ReplyDeleteBlaaah.. screw the firestorm, focus on phoenix! That's what we are all waiting for! :P
ReplyDeletephoenix ! phoenix ! phoenix ! WE WANT phoenix!!!
Speaking of Firestorm, when are you guys going to move to the 3.2x codebase with the new V3.2 customizable UI?
ReplyDeleteThat should allow the Phoenix die-hards to customize their own interface layout and at the same time allow you guys to shift the majority of the installed base over to a modern viewer with multilayers and mesh that isn't a kluged-in rendering hack.
umm yah not all of us are waiting for phoenix, i'm much happier with firestorm it performs way better for me, and the graphical upgrades and projected lighting and projected textures YES PLEASE!, it's awesome, i am so done with phoenix firestorm is definately the better viewer, i have introduced enough phoenix users to firestorm and helped them make the migration, most are now very comfy and happy on firestorm, yes t's set up differently and buttons are in different places but it only take a day or two to figure it out and a week to adjust and your smooth sailing, and before yah make any comments about conetnt creation i've been building and erraforming on firestorm for months, i've designed and built sims on it with zero issues, the only bugs i have are basic UI ones and a few mesh ones but all in all i'm still happier with firestorm the phoenix and look foward to the changes to come, this is by far the best viewer i've been on since is started SL 6 years ago and i'm extremely happy with it even with the bugs, Change is constant, Change is inevitable Change will happen whether you are on board with it or not, you can either adapt and change with it or get left behind. Firestorm is the future, phoenix is the past, libraries are still open even though they are obsolete, as will phoenix still be open until it can no longer function on the LL grid
ReplyDelete@HippiDongy
ReplyDeleteWhy would anyone in their right minds focus on Phoenix?
For better or worse, Phoenix is V1 and V1 is dead.
That's like asking someone to focus on making the space shuttle more efficient after the shuttle program has ended. Meh. Or did you just want to troll ?
FIRESTORM FIRESTORM FIRESTORM!!! I'm totally addicted to mesh fashion because of firestorm. I love the new organization of inventory and the windset to perform photography. Yeah... it lags a lill bit in crowded sims.. and when i visit a sim the first time i can go make coffee and do some laundry but otherwise is soooooooooooooooo AWESOME!!! I can't imagine it better! waiting for you guys to blow my mind like in each release. DEAD to PHOENIX! LONG LIFE FIRESTORM!!
ReplyDeleteNo CAO, no wow :(
ReplyDeleteI greatly wait that ugly bug (FIRE-1624) will be fixed to effectively start using Firestorm and leave Phoenix as, with many and many other Phoenix's users, I've an huge load of gestures which relies on Phoenix/Firestorm's commands to work (e.g. /go2alphabase = mapto alphabase + wait 10" + gtp 128 128 3456).
With this feature still broken (and it needs just to filter ALSO the gesture's chat command via the chat-filtering features of firestorm's main chat only) I can't efficently use Firestorm and forced to "fall back" to Phoenix. :(
Anyway, very good work on all the rest of the viewer: keep going on, I'm amazed! :)
All I want to say is THANK YOU for ALL the hard work. The Firestorm BETA with Mesh support is awesome, and I look forward to the official release. No stomping up and down and whining about a feature here or feature there that will "drive me away" from Firestorm. No stomping up and down and demanding that you pay more attention to PHOENIX (which I use also).
ReplyDeleteJUST A GIANT, HUGE, MASSIVE, APPRECIATIVE, and SINCERE...THANK YOU and KEEP UP THE GOOD and DEDICATED WORK!
Thank you so much for Firestorm. There are still some build features in Phoenix that I miss, but Phoenix is only a special-cases tool for me nowadays. I'm not one that really minds interface variations so much. I come to Firestorm for the features. With the UI improvements in LL's V3.2, I hope you'll have more time to spend on features, and won't have to spend so much time on User Interface issues.
ReplyDeleteThe Graphics problems reported need to be fixed before Firestorm, or the Linden Viewer, can be considered properly out of Beta.
ReplyDeleteI am glad to hear that the holdup hasn't been "because we once again shifted all our resources to v1 development." (it has been this way in the past unfortunately).
ReplyDeleteI am one of the many who suffer from the OGL 460GTX bug that crashes the client when shadders are enabled but although the fix isn't in the official 3.1 LL release, there are development builds with the fix. LL finally agreed to buy a 460GTX and fix the problem after months and months of complaining. I currently use Firestorm 2.5.2 because it doesn't contain the OGL bugs that were introduced in 2.7.x and up (pre mesh).
Rachel,
ReplyDeletePlease read my post above to why I use Phoenix as Firestorm is no use to me as it is.
Please note I am in my right mind.
I can't ever go back to phoenix :( i don't like that i cant where multiple tattoo layers (i wear like 3 or 4 at a time) and there are a few other things i no longer like about phoenix since getting used to firestorm, however i get so mad b/c firestorm can load all my gestures so it will crash me automatically before i can even Rezz in world :( also i have been a cloud for almost 2 days now and if i have rezzed i have been wearing more stuff than i wanted to wear....some things wouldnt come off of me etc. oh i hope the final firestorm is better i am tired of some of the problems i have been having :(
ReplyDeleteTry to make the borders of the windows as small as they are in phoenix, i want to see the graphics, not the borders. Every pixel is important. I hate the UI of Viewer2 and Firestorm looks still like Viewer 2. It´s ok to use viewer 2 code, but please try to build the UI as it is in phoenix. There is not one thing thats better in the Viewer 2 UI.
ReplyDeleteRadar is neccessary for me, but the radar in firestorm take to much place in the sreen. It should be possible to see the radar window without that buttons for contacts and groups and so, in want to see the radar all time, but i don´t need to see my contact list and gruplist all time. the radar window takes to much place so. also i would like the feature to see who uses voice, in the local chat window, like in phoenix.
ReplyDeleteNOTHING in firestorm is better for me as ist is in phoenix, sorry but i have to tell this.
My first car was a 1948 Ford. Today of course I drive a modern vehicle with all the bells and whistles one would expect. Strangely though all of the controls in my current vehicle are in more or less the same place they were in the old Ford and work pretty much the same way. I used to work for a major computer company and every time they came out with a new version of a program most of our tech support calls revolved around why something had been removed. Generally, nothing had been removed, it had just been moved. Why must we always search for something that used to always be in plane sight or at least we knew where it was and what it was called. Is it just a computer thing that now we have to search through three layers of menus for something that may not be called the same thing any more?
ReplyDeleteBTW, I don't have that 1948 Ford any more, but I'm pretty sure it would still travel on the roads of today at the same speed as the rest of the traffic.
Did I mention I like Phoenix?
Yes, I know the world moves on and the dinosaur is extinct now but just once it would be nice to see a viewer that could do all the neat stuff but not have to look totally different
I am surprised to read the comments of this blog post vs the last one. In the past month have all the Phoenix uses who were stomping their feet (probably the same ones who opposed voice back in the day, they were extremely against new features) finally tried Firestorm? Sounds like it to me. I am looking forward to the next release of Firestorm, hopefully with a more stable release of the renderer.
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely quote Giacomo Sparx and the following, Jack: at least the UI can be designed to match Phoenix as closely as possible, you're (hopefully) porting Phoenix's (unique!!!) features to Firestorm and we all 're waiting for this but... why I have to search all that damn'd menus just to find where the ARC display is gone? :D
ReplyDeleteOk, rationalisation is a good choice but even not to move everything everytime is. ;)))
Well... I'm sure that no choice you will do will prevent me to use Firestorm at last but, please (please please please please) try keeping the "visual port" as much "clean" (uncluttered) as possible, 1 pixel borders, Phoenix (truly) like UI etc. etc.
And... oh... THANKS again for all that wonderful work: I wish to be able to contribute also but I'm not able to, so I try to (at least) "suggest" some things which can be useful for all. :)
Okay, THANK you for finally getting mesh for Phoenix! Although I like Singularity and Cool VL Viewer, the latter of which already has mesh, Phoenix is my first favorite.
ReplyDeleteAlthough I understand your dislike for the viewer that made first Emerald and not Phoenix arguably the #1 third party viewer for SL, more SL users prefer the UI of Phoenix and other Viewer 1-based viewers. It makes sense to continue developing both Phoenix and Firestorm so users always have a choice.
@June You get used to not having the flycam indicator pretty rapidly. While I'd much rather have an indicator of some sort, I certainly don't see it as a dealbreaker to using the viewer. What would be neat is if they could use the LED on the Space Navigator for that indicator.
ReplyDeleteKari said "I certainly don't see it as a dealbreaker to using the viewer. What would be neat is if they could use the LED on the Space Navigator for that indicator."
ReplyDeleteIt certainly effects my smooth enjoyment of movement, so I will continue with Phoenix, or alternatives that do have the FLYCAM Indecator. I am just a plug and play user not computer expert like many commenting here, I drive my car but do not know how it works as I not have to to drive it.
So I not understand how the SpaceNavigator programming for 99% of its use is in Firestorm but this 1% is not, when it is 100% in Phoenix etc.
Do not know what you mean by the LED on the unit. If you mean the blue glow I do not have that, as I found it does not need the SpaceNavigators Drivers to be loaded in my computer for it to work on Second Life. Second Life runs the SpaceNavigator itself and I think smoother without the SpaveNavigator Driver.
Can I comment on the look on the screen of Firestorm from my user piont of view it seems at download to look very much like Linden V2 and the team have made things movable/changeable so we can make it look more or less like Phoenix and V1, the reason being we want it to look like Phoenix could the download of FS allready have these in? Then those that want FS to look like Linden V2 would do the changes/movements.
While we are on the subject of requesting features. The news feed would be nice. I am not sure why 3.0.1 doesn't have it. Perhaps it is based on older code.
ReplyDeleteThank you, thank you! I look forward to the next release of Firestorm. (I'm especially hoping that the problem I reported to LL in SH-2526 is corrected.)
ReplyDeleteFantastic news!
ReplyDeleteFirestorm is by far my favourite viewer and when the Linden Labs Viewer crashes so often in Linux and firestorm does not the ability to upload mesh in firestorm is very very welcome. As for phoenix i dont give a monkeys about that, i left that behind maybe 9 months ago now. Think i might just download the repository and compile for a sneak preview.
Aside from the pathetic UI on V2 (which can be partially avoided with this new GOOD idea of having a customizable UI in the dev viewer), does anyone get massively irritated by not being able to click on the window/ in the window and immedatly be able to type in local chat? This bugs me to no end! No I don't want to move. Thats what my arrow keys are for. I don't want to have to select the field every time I want to type after switching windows or performing some action within Secondlife and returning to typeing. This drives me innnssaannnee! Also long live the pie menu! Thank you Firestorm Developers for having the pie menu option. But yeah please do something about this typing madness. Save us all...
ReplyDeletemissing my spellchecker....*pouts*
ReplyDeletemissing my spellchecker.....*pouts*
ReplyDeletePHOENIX,...PHOENIX,...PHOENIX !!!
ReplyDeleteFOREVER!
And
FOREVER!
PHOENIX,...PHOENIX,...PHOENIX !!!
I love Firestorm - really can't stand Phoenix now (NEVER thought I would be saying that...) and really looking forward to the new release.
ReplyDeleteThat said, I really hope it fixes 2 things: the amount of times it freezes then logs me out when I try to log on (performance is terrible at times, mostly when logging in) and there seemed to be a problem loading multiple mesh objects recently - I was at a fashion show and mesh was fine until people started changing outfit when the 'mesh queue' just started going up and nothing new rezzed. Otherwise, awesome job so far and really got my fingers crossed for this release!
Really shouldn't change the UI with Mainline viewer. Honestly the more its changed the more people just give up on SL. Which more often then not the UI changes are the #1 compliant I hear about on any viewer except Cool (Still back in the day of 1.19 or earlier.)
ReplyDeleteThere will always be change but you don't need to change the UI every time there is a new feature. I mean look at MySpace, lots of changes there but not many people really like it anymore.
This may sound silly..but I uploaded the mesh beta then found there is no way to customise the environment/skies. Is it moved or hidden somewhere..?..all i could find was the presets but no sliders for sun position etc etc
ReplyDeleteOhh and BTW, I found disabling HTTP get textures speeded up texture loading a great deal. This may help those having to go do the laundry as a sim loads
ReplyDeletePhoenix, its the only viewer that runs my Vga settings.
ReplyDeleteWith it i run at 32 AA and 16q antialising bypassing ingame and forcing it to use my Gtx580 ones!
Singularity with meshes only allows me to use the inbuilt regular 2 antialising and 16aa.
My major concerns are 1) Lack of spelling checker, appears going to be in the next release. 2) Unable to add the AO to the viewer> Have done this with Phoenix and other viewers and have been surprised at how much lag is reduced. I tried the button on the bottom without success and attempted to use the instructions for Phoenix which alos failed to work.
ReplyDeleteMetwo - I find the AO on Firestorm a massive improvement over the one on Phoenix, and much easier to use.
ReplyDeleteCheck out Zi Ree's video tutorials, they show how easy it is:
1. Importing AOs
2. Creating custom AOs
I am only interested in how Phoenix is going to be honest.
ReplyDeleteFirestorm crashes too much at the moment.
Yeh the Firestorm AO is rediculusly easy to use its simply drag and drop.
ReplyDeleteIm realy looking forward to the new firestorm and some of the fixes that it will have.
Firestorm for me is by far the best TVP out there it offers great features / stability / performance over all others. I tryed goign back to try phoenix and dang the graphics looked terable it laged bad and took ages to load then changed to firestorm and bang instant loading and minimal lag.
I hear alot complain about how slow and laggy firestorm is and in my experiance helpi9ng alot of my freinds it partly comes down to out of date hardware that there useing but moastly comes down to incorect settings or poorly set up settings. You would be seprised the amount of people that simply install the program and expect it to set itself up for you and run perfectly. where as in reality you have to install it and spend time changeing settings to what best suits your indavidial hardware to get the best performance., The first i would do to get an instant loading boost is disable Http textures i realy dont see the point in this feature as all it dus is seem to slow down the loading prossess and disabeling then clearing your cache and relogging will defonatly make your firestorm load way faster.
If Phoenix can get the multi-layer clothing option, I wouldbe a happy Phoenix user.
ReplyDeleteJessica and the whole team I want to thank you for all of the selfless work you put into Firestorm and Phoenix. I love Firestorm and am sooo waiting for the mesh release. My bestie still loves Phoenix and will probably give it up only when it absolutely can't be made to work any longer. We both love and depend on the extra features and are comfortable with the more restrained release schedule in exchange for fewer bugs.
ReplyDeletePlease do not waste your time implementing the new SL Viewer 3.2 GUI, it is the worst interface I've ever tried to use in SL.
Thanks,
~Arcadia~
First TY TY for putting Mesh into our beloved Phoenix! I was so burned out on the UI in V2. So we thank you for keeping our familiar UI, thus giving us choices.
ReplyDeleteMight I push this and ask if you can also include in the future update the ability to do a prim url/youtube? Or is that too encased into V2? If so no biggy, never hurts to ask though. ;)
First TY TY for putting Mesh into our beloved Phoenix! I was so burned out on the UI in V2. So we thank you for keeping our familiar UI, thus giving us choices.
ReplyDeleteMight I push this and ask if you can also include in the future update the ability to do a prim url/youtube? Or is that too encased into V2? If so no biggy, never hurts to ask though. ;)
"a fix for folders that land outside your main inventory folder." Love it! I have had folders sitting outside my inventory for over a year and LL's help-desk responded to my ticket with, "there's no way to fix that." I'm looking forward to proving them WRONG!!!
ReplyDeleteI would like to see more concentration of effort on improving Firestorm. Those of us who have accustomed ourselves to the UI have learned to love it even more than Phoenix, which was wonderful and the most useful of all of the viewers.
ReplyDeleteI would like to use mesh objects, but they don't appear normally to those that don't use the new mesh enabled viewers, so.. we have to wait..and wait.
This feature alone is worth pushing forward instead of hanging back. I know that many will cling to Phoenix and not want to move on. That's their choice, but the rest of us don't want to wait any longer. We want mesh!
I'm definitely looking forward to being able to upload mesh with Firestorm. While the latest LL viewer with that new UI isn't bad, I don't like having to switch between viewers to upload and then build and LL's just doesn't have the building tools.
ReplyDeleteI guess bolting mesh into Phoenix is a good thing only because then everyone will be able to see those objects so they will get used more even if it is going to be very kludgy code.
I run firestorm almost exclusivly. It has some issues that well i am sure you all are aware of but I am starting to really like mesh and sorry a half broken phonix with mesh is not going to cut it for me.
ReplyDeleteI cant wait till firestorms next release and i hope its soon.
I would love to help you all test it on the way to release if you need it.
Jini
Today I tried Viewer 3.2 and compared it with Firestorm... well, a BIG difference! but now lets stop playing around (closes Firestorm..) and getting back to work (..opening Phoenix viewer), I want to hear more about "Phoenix with Mesh" because this feature if stable enought will be a serious Viewer 3/Firestorm "KILLER" feature, who wants the lag associated with lighting and shadows and some other silly features who only adds lag and bugs? and everything beautifully framed by an uncomprehensible UI who only a small fraction of beginners seems to love in majority? lets be clear, "3" is not progress just because is a higher number than "1", keep that in mind.
ReplyDelete@ Belldandy
ReplyDeleteYou have it backwards. There is absolutely nothing that is going to stop Viewer 2 code from becoming the eventual standard that everybody has to use. The only thing bolting on mesh does for Phoenix is to do LL a favor by getting Mesh adopted faster. Phoenix and all other v1 viewers are on their last legs. Eventually there will be features that it simply won't make sense to backport and that will be that.
Also, considering that Firestorm is (AFAIK) the only useable 2.x viewer still being actively developed, it's especially important that Firestorm get the dev time to keep it moving forward. Phoenix is never going to be the priority project again. I actually hope the release with mesh is the last one for Phoenix.
Well Kari I not wanting any more development to Phoenix and hope this Mesh update to it keeps it going, I said why above it is the only one that works my SpaceNavigator, if Phoenix fails to work then I'm out of SL, end of story.
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me that everybody thinks that phoenix will be just phoenix with mesh. Sorry guys. Thats not the case!
ReplyDeletePhoenix will be based on the Cool VL Viewer engine. Which means that they took the render engine of V2 and stuff it into a V1 interface.
That also still means: same lag as a V2 viewer. (if thats your favorite argument) same loopholes.
For example: no SSE2 will mean... no mesh and probably a far less stable phoenix for you as well.
Don't get me wrong. i loved phoenix to bits. but i arranged myself with the thought that its time is over.
You worry me now about Phoenix.
ReplyDeleteWill I loose the SpaceNavigator FLYCAM indecator from Phoenix as new Linden Viewers and Firestorm do not have it?
Please, for the love of hell, just fix the windlight setting for Mac w/ Lion OS. No work around or debug settings(useenvirofromregion set to false)work, even the debug changes on every tp. It's totally miserable and frustrating.
ReplyDelete@June
ReplyDeleteYeah, you probably won't have the indicator and will just have to remember which mode you're in. Those of us with one of these should be happy we have the amount of direct support for it at all. It's not exactly something owned by a large percentage of SL users. Yes I'd prefer to have an indicator of some type, but there are numerous other features that affect a much larger range of users I'd rather the dev team focus on first.
Thanks Kari, bad news day then.
ReplyDeleteHopefuly one of the other third party viewers will have the FLYCAM Indecator feature.
I know it might not be the #1 priority for developers, but a native 64 bit version of Phoenix or Firestorm would be brilliant. After all, developing in 32 bit today is kind of like developing in 16 bit in the mid 1990s.
ReplyDelete-Z
@June
ReplyDeleteAs far as I know, Firestorm is the only currently viable and actively developed TPV based on V2 code. Kirstens is on hiatus and the Imprudence/Kokua team haven't even done a useable beta of a 2.x viewer much less anything more.
I wouldn't give up on Firestorm every getting an indicator, but it probably won't be soon. As fast as LL is changing their viewer, every change the Phoenix devs have to make from that code makes it that much harder to merge to the next version. Maybe there is a simple way to add an on screen indicator. I don't know as I'm not a coder. Perhaps submit it as a feature request on the Jira page.
It's now been three weeks since this blog entry was posted. That's rather longer than "soon"! Some word about what's going on with the FS release would be much appreciated.
ReplyDeleteWell I felt it might be meaning 2 Christmas presents, one for Forestorm and one for Phoenix.
ReplyDeleteI must say, that I'm LOVING Firestorm as it is right now. It has its moments of acting up, but it's made so much progress since the preview, that I now use the mesh beta as my primary viewer. I have to say, though, that originally, the mesh beta ran slower for me than Phoenix or even the beta prior to the mesh. However, I found that if I disabled OpenGL and enabled VBO, that fixed my frame rate. I definitely suggest that to other FS users who are having a similar problem with frame rates. :)
ReplyDeleteKeep up the good work, guys. :) I eagerly await the next release.
Maggy,Fs has autoresponse,did you ever even looked it.? Seems not
ReplyDeleteHere's a question for you in regards to "Your Phoenix Viewer", How about the source code that was taken from Emerald and the countless amount of Emerald Developers code you use in Phoenix yet fail to mention or credit in Phoenix? It's rather unfortunate but not surprising in the least. I just find it amusing that you credit yourself for being the "Founder" of Phoenix when in fact you haven't physically written one line of code that exists in your Viewer. It's not to say that your Phoenix dev's haven't contributed to "Emerald 2", but none the less, you're essentially a thief. This will end up being the demise of the Phoenix project, that I can assure you. Take care Jess.
ReplyDeleteCan I haz update plz?
ReplyDeleteI want to see the day when Fs is final relese and especially what year it will be :)
ReplyDeleteIt's been close to a month now since this was posted, I was expecting the release to be soon ie within a month and not a month out when the word "soon" was used. I looked forward to the dau I could login without crashing or people causing drama because others are wearing mesh and they can't see it.
ReplyDeleteI am rather disappointed as well right now. I know this is not an easy task, and people are doing this for free. I am very appreciative of what they all do, since they do it so well. But one would think that when it was posted, soon... it would not be a month later. But then, maybe I am just being impatient...
ReplyDeleteLet's just be patient I have no idea what the "soon" had meant, maybe it was very soon and a problem occured and is being dealt with, after all we want it as near perfect as they can provide.
ReplyDeleteTo me as you say I got a month in my mind when soon was mentioned, then I thought better make that thinking the end of that month.
So might be a week or so yet on that thinking.
Please let us not presure the Team in their work for us to benefit from.
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ReplyDeletelol @ phoenix viewer lovers. n lol @ every complaining about almost everything like if they paid for this viewer or they donated a piece of their body for phoenix lol, it's time to get a life you all. for all of you that are down with firestorm n support the dev team in what they think is best for THEIR viewer, word up to you all, cuz the way i see it, firestorm kicks ass!! you guys couldn't have done a better job with it, n for phoenix, that is long gone n dead, i don't know why people are stuck on something that has passed away. move on people you will only be disappointed when the time comes your, that precious dead viewer will not work for you. stop crying over such little things for the love of god you all sound worse than a crying baby, if you don't like the way they are running the new improved viewer, then it's time for you to get a life if all you're going to do is cry n cry n cry about a viewer you don't even put money into. for all of the firestorm team n supporters, you guys know whats up n know a dead thing when you see one n you all embrace the new era, the new times of second life, i sure thank god technology has improved or else we all would still be traveling on boats through rivers instead of cars, and roads, but i guess people who cry about the phoenix viewer n want sooo many things, they can't even grasp the new improved n better things that blows all the old things out of the water, literally. but i guess that's why they sit there behind their little keyboards n cry about it cause they have nothing better to do in their life, or maybe it's the fact their life is so sad they have to cut down the amazing work the firestorm team is doing to improve a better game play for us. well its one of the above or all. well keep up the good work guys!! i love the firestorm, n whenever you get the 3.0 release, n by all means i am not paying for this nor am i putting even an ounce of effort into developing this viewer, so please take your time, i am not a cry baby, i am a huge supporter of what you guys are doing n most importantly from someone who appreciates everything in life, you guys are the difference in this viewer. i love your work, i love what you're doing for us n don't take crap from these cry babies, you guys are on the right track, keep rocking it out guys. 1 love 1 peace n your biggest supporter through everything you think is best for the viewer!!
ReplyDeletePHOENIX/V1 IS DEAD ACCEPT IT N GET OVER IT!! ITS NOT COMING BACK NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU CRY MORE THAN YOUR CHILDREN LMAO
LONG LIVE FIRESTORM/V3!!!!!!!!!!!!!
JARHED4LIFE, Found your 3 posts hard to read but I did have ago.
ReplyDeleteFirst, We use Phoenix because it is an Official Released Viewer and it is not dead as you suggest.
Second, Firestorm is not born yet and the Firestorm that you are using is Beta develoment and what is coming and people are waiting for is an Official Realease version.
Many will stop using Phoenix and transfer to Firestorm when it is an Official Release as they never use development versions.
i hope firestorm will be more like phoenix when its fully released.i love the double tats and clothing layers, but the font is to small even on its biggest setting i have to squint to see it.and i miss the inventory refinments like looking just for notecards gestures etc.and still alittle to hard to use. so untill firestorm is realy born i will stay with pheonix as it much more friendly and easy to use.
ReplyDeleteOk, I get the debate-and-hate between Phoenix lovers and Firestorm lovers, and the inability or refusal of either or both to get and/or accept the others' viewpoint. So please don't feel the need to come at me hammer and tongs with your insults and criticisms of my preferences and think you have a right to know why I prefer that so you can then pull my reasons apart. I'm not your kid, so back off, if that is your auto-response to my question: Did I miss something when I downloaded the latest Phoenix? I gather from previous posts that I should be able to view mesh features now, even using Phoenix, but I see the mesh items as a ball off to the side of the avatar wearing them. Is there a setting I am overlooking that, once changed, will allow me to see the mesh items as they are intended to be seen? (Please note further disclaimer: this is not a gripe, complaint, whinge or whine, this is a serious question seeking information, quite straightforward and needs nothing more than a reply supplying the information requested. I will not respond to any responses other than those which provide me the information I am requesting. Thank you and have a nice day.)
ReplyDeleteOk, I’ve been using Firestorm for a few weeks now, alongside Phoenix. The truth is, I like them both. Each seems to have something the other doesn't and other viewers have features neither of those have. I don't believe there is any ONE viewer that covers ALL the needs and wants of EVERYONE.
ReplyDeleteSo, let's make the best of what we are getting (for free) and stop yelling at each other.
Lisa, it is very clear the situation on Mesh and Phoenix in the Blog above to me.
ReplyDeleteFirestorm it was said to have its First release soon.
Followed by update of Phoenix with Mesh a few weeks later.
Of course by now we must be in that estimated time scale so people are getting jumpy, and some not being very nice which is a shame.
I was using firestorm on my mpb, however now it doesnt even open, so ive had to go back to phoenix.. which is fine because i like it more anyway.. just add mesh!!
ReplyDeleteits been nearly 4 weeks, wheres the update??
Just a small question...Will Firestorm have any skin selections to chooose from the current Phoenix button layout, (the ones at the bottom of the screen), to the current SecondLife button layout, (The way the butons are set up on the side of the screen)?, because there are some of us users(me included!), that are not too keen on the way the Secondlife viewers buttons are set up.
ReplyDeleteCorrect me if I'm wrong, the last and only stable release offered for download is Phoenix_Viewer-1.5.2.1185, I guess it's from August 2011 (that's this year).
ReplyDeleteThen Firestorm 2 never made it to final, 2.5.2 is the beta, right? Since July?
Firsetorm 3 was released beta in September.
If some here believe Phoenix is dead, what would they call this?
I wouldn't call that development, I'd call it STUCK.
Reminds me of the LL way: don't fix bugs, only implement something new and shiny. (I think this way was forced on Firestorm/phoenix by LL, correct?)
Tomorrow will be a MONTH since your "Coming Soon" post.
ReplyDeleteCan you possibly update us on what is happening?
@Jori, probably still working on porting Mesh to Phoenix. They may have taken on something that took much greater resources and time than they thought. Extending the life of a dying product was not a good idea in the first place but since so many of their users are attached to it, they caved in and worked to extend its life.
ReplyDeleteI have been using Firestorm 2.5.2 for months and been happy. Wish it had the ability to0 Mesh render mesh.
My real guess as to why it is taking so long for them to come out with the next version of Firestorm is because LL introduced a terrible graphics bug in 2.8.x which crashes NVIDIA 4xx card as soon as the game launches. The problem has been fixed for a month or so but it is only included in experimental builds. Why LL hasn't included it in the stable release yet is beyond me. As it is, this bug affects many people and LL as usual is extremely slow to fix it. I read somewhere a long the lines that one of the Phoenix developers has an affected card and of course will have to deal with this show stopper bug. Hopefully they are by now working with the graphic engine code included in the beta builds. My guess is until LL includes this into their stable builds, a new Firestorm will be on hold. After all, Phoenix does not want to say that the major release of Firestorm was built off a LL experiental build.
I really hope you folks consider bringing the edit appareance window as its in v1 and phoenix, and draggable textures over it. Working on larger bulks of body layers and skins, in loading time and number of clicks, changes consistently (1 drag compared to 10 clicks, multiple window switching, etc). Please consider that too, would be extremely grateful till the end of the world. Another thing I really miss when on firestorm is selecting multiple item's propreties, allows a very fast check on perms.I know my needs are not those of the majority of people, but its hard to pass from something that is really functional to 10% of it. Those are the main reasons why I still cant use firestorm fully, even if look forward to it.
ReplyDeleteKeep up the good work by the way, you rock.
And don't rush, good things come to those who wait.
@Doro
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, LL introduced some rather nasty bugs with the Mesh code. The Phoenix team would probably prefer to not release an official non-beta release with something known to crash those with higher end Nvidia cards. I am not enjoying the wait either given some of the awesome added features we'll be getting, but I'd rather have it be right than be fast.
One of the things I miss most from Phoenix is the ability to move down a list, such as the friends list, by typing the first letter of what I am looking for. If I want to find someone named John, all I have to do is type J to be taken to the top of the J's. The same is true in the inventory. In Firestorm I have to scroll all the way down. If I'm looking for something that starts with Z that's a lot of scrolling.
ReplyDeleteHonestly... one would think time could be better spent rebuilding the UI of Firestorm to LOOK like Phoenix and older V1 viewers, rather than rebuilding the V1 code with a blend of V3 code...
ReplyDeleteAfter all, the only gripe I have with V2-V3 viewers is the UI...
i use both Firestorm and Phoenix, though would prefer to use Phoenix full time. The only thing that switched me over to Firestorm was the ability to wear more than one tattoo layer (minus the small glitch it has). So two quick questions...
ReplyDeleteWill Phoenix have the feature to ADD tattoo layers? Right now it that you can only wear one.
Will Firestorm and Phoenix have the tattoo layer glitch worked out? Though it's an SL issue it seems. JIRA for it is here: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-25775
Would someone please take five minutes to post a short message to the blog explaining what is holding up the FS release? It's been a month since we've heard anything.
ReplyDeleteFor many of us, FS 3 in its present form is unusable. My fps goes through the floor when I log in with the beta version, but is just fine with FS 2.5.
Yes Rachel a little update would be nice on the Firestorm and its holdup.
ReplyDeleteAlso is the Phoenix new release being held back untill FS is sorted?
Most of SL users still using Phoenix that is apparent in world so update of Phoenix now would be appreciated.
ok might be off the main topic but you mentioned in this blog that pheonix with mesh suport will be available after your firestorm mesh update is released, i might have missed something, but a few months ago i was under the impresion that pheonix will be defunct due to linden server based grid or something, being phased out , so i was kinda frightend into getting firestorm downloaded, does this mean that pheonix will no longer be defunct and all those that were worried that they had to get firestorm can now relax and carry on with pheonix? its all to me a bit confusing
ReplyDeletesina frequency said...
ReplyDeleteok might be off the main topic but you mentioned in this blog that pheonix with mesh suport will be available after your firestorm mesh update is released, i might have missed something, but a few months ago i was under the impresion that pheonix will be defunct due to linden server based grid or something, being phased out , so i was kinda frightend into getting firestorm downloaded, does this mean that pheonix will no longer be defunct and all those that were worried that they had to get firestorm can now relax and carry on with pheonix? its all to me a bit confusing
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For the moment Phoenix will continue to work to a certain level and with mesh suport should extend the life of it for a short time however very soon in the neer future linden will be rolling out changes server side that will result in all v1 viewers to be broken tho still functional in a very limited way. Eventualy linden with block all v1 viewers. So i would say that if your computer can handle it stick with firestorm mesh and spend alittle time tweaking the settings and UI once you have done this the UI is very phoenix like and the performance matches phoenix. If however you have problems or performance problems wioth firestorm due to an old PC then the chances are you will also not beable to run phoenix mesh as it uses the same graphics rendering code that firestom uses
is it just me, or is firestorm beta started acting up, by being multi colourful, and blocky?
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ReplyDeleteMy assumption is that mesh will have its breakthrough only when the official Firestorm release will have been rolled out (and, maybe, the mesh Phoenix). A statistician will scream at what I say for its statistical insignificance, but at the few house and techno clubs I attend (and shops I visit) with their mainly SL-savvy audience most people by far are using Phoenix, a few Firestorm, with an occasional Linden viewer or another TPV here and there. I myself have been buying mesh clothes from vendors I know when they offered a bargain, but just to have the stuff handy when I’ll have finally switched to a V3-viewer. For the time being I won’t use mesh because nobody would see me properly which is really no way to go. And I still prefer the Phoenix UI anyway, so why would I switch?
ReplyDeleteI have a hunch that Linden Lab are going to block V1-based viewers to force everybody onto the same code base as soon as they can do it without too much risk. As I’m quite sure that Linden Lab won't want to lose any larger numbers of the huge Phoenix following, I reckon they’ll ban V1 when Firestorm is well established (which will certainly not be before Linden Lab themselves have removed the bad bugs from the code they provide TPV devs with). Forcing Phoenix/Firestorm-users onto the Linden Viewer is no promising alternative because that might lose them users and their business. People probably won’t even mainly stay away because of a conscious decision. They will just find, at a rather sub-conscious level, handling the Linden Viewer somewhat tedious, so their sessions will get shorter. Then the frequency of sessions will drop. Then they will reach the point where they ask themselves what the heck they are playing Second Life for anyway. That’s when they will stop playing altogether.
This situation is undoubtedly interesting. But I swear that I’d much prefer a surrounding where everything is running smoothly and I wouldn’t dream of thinking about the viewer I am using in the first place. Oh well...
so when is the new release allready? i cant wait until its there! Give me a date!
ReplyDeleteThis situation becomes more and more unbearable. I am fully aware that the phoenix team works on a voluntary base.
ReplyDeleteBUT i really really hope that they KNOW how much impact they got on Second Life's economy by holding back mesh in phoenix and the final firestorm.
I really could care less about phoenix. But my customers don't. Making it my problem to deal with in the first place.
So with much influence comes alot of responsebility. And i really hope you guys know what you are doing.
Aeon, hold on a minute Second Life belongs to Linden have a go at them if you doing business in thier game as to why thier Viewer not doing Mesh.
ReplyDeleteI'm wondering if it is Linden that are show stopping in this matter.
To all who are oscillating between impatience and impudence: You should carefully re-read Jessica’s statements. It is known that the Linden devs are fighting some significant issues inside their code. Updated versions of that code will be frequently handed to the TPV community which has to test the new code base against their features after having put things together. As this is very much a work in progress, everybody involved will find it quite hard to give any dates. And one may be quite certain that the Linden devs as well as the TPV devs are giving their very best to get things done as quickly as possible. Coding isn't as easy as cupcake-baking, I should think...
ReplyDeleteBtw: Pressing the Firestorm team isn’t helpful at all. They can only work with what they get until they achieve results which they find worth handing over to the public.
Anyway, I personally would prefer a rock solid official Firestorm release over just another beta.
June. I really respect the Dev team. I really do. I just needed to remind them how much influence they actually got.
ReplyDeleteThe linden viewer does has mesh. Just a fraction actually uses it because they love to stick to the V1 Interface. Firestorm is the step into the right direction i am sure but Phoenix remains the mainstay. If the Phoenix devs like it or don't.
I mean it is really not funny when i get threatened by residents with an AR for fraud because their TPV of choice does not support mesh.
All i could do is to re-cite the official stance of LL which clearly states that you use TPVs at own risk. To no avail.
People are holding back because of phoenix. And there is where the responsebility chims in.
They do it for free, for which we are all very grateful i believe. But with more and more mesh products hitting the market the merchants become icky. that much of an influence does phoenix has.
Sure we could tell them to go V3 or Firestorm or even Singularity. But in the end they yell for phoenix. If we like it or we don't.
And mesh only really will be on the grid if the majority of the users can see it.
I'm very sure it is actually LLs fault that TPVs got so big. Because they never put so much efford into the viewer like the TPV developers did. For the later we are grateful for the first: LL wake up.
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ReplyDeleteHavent seen a mesh product that I care about yet, nor have I seen anything that convinces me that upgrading my graphics card JUST to stay in SL is worth it. Unfortunately MOST people can't afford it either.
ReplyDeleteWanting the space shuttle after the program is cancelled?? Stupid metaphor... it's simple economics. If LL wants to push people out of SL they are doing a damned good job of it. Just force us to upgrade or leave. We will leave, when I have to choose between a 300 dollar graphics card or food, and rent.... SL loses.
How about the fact that MOST people simply want a viewer that they don't have to spend 200 to 300 USD JUST to be able to run, like many in SL am on a fixed or low income.
The vast majority of us don't give a rat's ass about mesh, we only wish to be able to enjoy the interaction with our friends in SL, and not have to keep spending money we don't have just to stay. Who cares about amazing graphics and every single pixel? IT'S ALREADY AMAZING... for most of us.
I like my old car, it runs just fine... and I can't afford a new one with all the bells and whistles. Too bad, the mass migration of people to other grids has started, and when SL dies because only those with money to spare can afford it, maybe the next owners will have some business sense and stop driving their customers away.
I agree 200% with the last post!
ReplyDeleteMesh has caused so much crap and is useless so far.
Scrap the mesh and stop fooling with viewers and just fix the things that are broken now so we can just carry on with what we already love about SL.
Mesh clothing looks horrible and does not fit without altering your avatar. That is reDICKulous and nobody is using it enough to cause so much upheaval.
Mesh is a failure!
My, my, above I should have said »…who are oscillating between impatience and impudence and imbecility…«
ReplyDeleteLooking at mesh, one should just recall (and best keep in mind) how long it took until sculpties were fully established and the products incorporating them became really good in terms of craftmanship and realistic appearance and people started buying them by and by. Mesh is just at the very beginning. If creators all of a sudden find it a bad move to have created mesh-products, well… Relying on the early adopters is always a tricky thing, and one does it at one’s own risk -- there’s nobody else to blame. Anyway, at the stores I know mesh-products are very clearly marked as »V3 or Firestorm Mesh Beta only!«, so customers normally should be prevented from making bad buys.
I don’t expect mesh to be really here before summer 2012, i. e. when people will be using mesh-products without giving it much thought.
(Btw: If I were a volunteer Firestorm dev dedicating heaps of my spare time to this demanding project, I would certainly flip some people the bird. I really would. But fortunately I am not a Firestorm dev.)
My english is wrong, sorry
ReplyDeleteDear Aeon.
Working FS in my computer, better GUI than phoenix, mesh etc, but I dont like. Why?
1.) slower, this is very big problem... I cant fly aeroplane with FS because too laggy...
2.) why mesh? I dont see too big different than sculpt... sometimes nothing, but sculpt loading 1-5 sec, mesh loading 30sec to 30 min!
Mesh no good feature just problem!
Mesh good for you, because easy build some object with outworld stuffs. Not good for me, and not good for sl users!
I like Phoenix! Fast! and enjoyable SL :)
If the new phoenix slower than mesh, I migrating os grid... This is the GAME, and if not enjoyable, I find new game!
Caoilte.
Perfect. The LL big fault:
Wrong idea the mesh! Why? Because many gamer, and landlord (ex landlord) housewife, and unemployed, and student, with low money, and SL live escape to RL... This is the past... Because LL say: buy expensive stuffs, or SL not enjoyable... Dream over, because the live in SL too expensive in RL! Many people and the big money (too many small linden = big money) out of SL... Game over...
Just see the map! How many land for sale? Just see the statistics, 2 years ago 140000 active gamer, now max 40000...
More system requirements, and thousands of people are going elsewhere, or to finish the game...
Wrong business politics...
If the new phoenix slower with mesh, I migrating other grid, because I no enjoying SL... Reason is simple, just I dont understand, empty the head of LL marketing manager? He/she dont see the reality? (sorry this words too strong but unfortunetly true)
SL no hardcore rpg game, for hardcore gamers (there are too few, bigger money/people but too low money), sl game for everyone, game for student, housewifes, low money workers, unemployed with low money (smaller money/people but bigger money), etc...
I waiting the phoenix with mesh, if now slower than actually phoenix realise...
I would love to be able to upgrade to Firestorm, but I am struggling with the same issues as with the Linden Viewer 2. Both seem to be incapable of loading graphics onto my screen. Much of the scenery is in silhouette and seems reluctant to load. Have I to alter some setting? Reading these comment I see many seem happy to use the new Firestorm. I want to be able to join them, but Firestorm isn't making it easy.
ReplyDeleteMick, you best ask inworld in the group »Phoenix/Firestorm Viewer Support« (use group search to join) to get a quick solution for your issues.
ReplyDeleteOnly some people has those problems with opengl. Why must others wait for a new Release?. I have no nvidia Card, i don't have the opengl issue, but i had to wait too. There is an Opengl fix FS release, but only beta testers get that.
ReplyDeleteWhen FS will release after Linden has resolved the opengl issue, than we will wait another 3 months or more.I'm no noob, i can decide myself, if i use a beta viewer or use it not. I use the Beta Mesh, so i'm already a beta tester since 3 months. Don't like the Release Policy like it happens now.
Thank you all so much! Firestorm is an amazing product and I am continually humbled by your selflessness and generosity. I teach art at California State University, Long Beach where 220 students, 7 TA's and I have all been using Firestorm to build 68 virtual art galleries.
ReplyDeletehttp://art110.wikispaces.com/vrag11f9
Unfortunately, my lead TA has demanded, and I have to admit that she's right, that we switch to LL V3 next semester for ONE reason: Clear Cache.
Something like 80% of the class have gotten the familiar hang on startup and come pleading for help. The Clear Cache instructions are not hard and it usually fixes it for most students. Still, it is an extra frustration that has fallen on well over half the class. Unlike people who come to SL by choice, my students are "forced" to go there to complete course assignments. So they're in a foreign place that they'd rather not bother with and then it "doesn't work."
Firestorm has so many advantages that I'll try to still use it some in my personal work, but with nearly 500 students / academic year trying to "get through it," this one issue is unfortunately a world of trouble for us.
Glenn, did you file a JIRA concerning this cache issue and/or did you try to get in touch with the devs themselves? If not I suggest that you do so speedily so that the matter might possibly be addressed in the forthcoming Firestorm release. Maybe it’s already in the pipeline anyway (or has been resolved). But you should ask directly and very specifically to get a quick and satisfactory answer if you want to make sure whether you can keep on using Firestorm or not in the setting you describe. This blog might not provide you with a direct line to the people in charge.
ReplyDeletewell hurry up will ya I am tired dealing with the old version cause of the recent version crashing my video driver
ReplyDelete@June
ReplyDeleteThe official release of Firestorm has a Flycam indicator!!!!!! Thanks Dev team!
Karl I love you, thank you.
ReplyDeleteNice Raymond... name calling?!?! Imbecility???
ReplyDeleteMaybe i should have said that SL will only be filled with those who can afford it, and computer geeks with no life living off of mom and dad and nothing else to do with their money that buy all the latest computer hardware. Must be nice.
Most of us merely want to eat and pay our rent and bills, and escape RL in SL.. without having to choose between them.
Ah but that's right.. we are imbeciles. Forgive my ignorance.
If you have older graphics hardware, and have trouble with corrupted textures on your avatar, turn off VBO in the preferences->graphics->hardware tab.
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ReplyDeleteFriend Caoilte, forgiving ignorance is something I do not subscribe to. I thought this much were clear. Anyway, if you think the hat fits, fine by me. But I didn’t refer to you. You only came up with some trite Linden-bashing.
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ReplyDeleteWell friend Raymond, you will just have to forgive me for taking offense for all the others that you may have offended. I didn't necessarily think or believe you meant me. Nor was I really being ignorant, I was being facetious. But maybe that's beyond the understanding of some.
ReplyDeleteI do however feel that name calling in any blog is counter productive, and shows a lack of maturity.
Yes I will bash the ones that came up with the idea to shove mesh enabled viewers down our throats. MOST of us simply can't run them, without upgrading our graphics cards. And not all of us can afford such upgrades, as I said three times already.
IT IS MORONIC to force people to upgrade their computers or leave SL.
140,000 users down to 40,000 (according to the statistics).... traffic is down grid-wide, and I suspect its LL's heavy handed, "our way or the highway" approach that has caused most of it.
"FIX THE CODE YOU ALREADY HAVE", I say.... and allow us to use whatever viewer works best for our systems. Other grids already have mesh... and it works without having to spend more money to upgrade, why can't LL do the same thing? I guess its like every other corporation, don't invest any money back into the thing, just suck all the money OUT of the thing. And force changes that saves THEM money, and force US to spend more.
Seems like bad business sense.
Friend Caoilte, Linden Lab are running a _business_, _not_ a _charity_. If I were in charge at Linden Lab, I’d be happy with 40,000 users who spend substantial sums of real money on Second Life and could very well do without those 100,000 who may not but only cost me a lot of dough in terms of infrastructure and power-consumption what with the servers themselves and cooling/air-conditioning (which isn’t cheap at all). In short: The assumption Linden Lab were harming their business by excluding users with old/weak hardware is just that. An assumption. And not necessarily a plausible one.
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ReplyDeleteFriend Raymond, your last post is nothing BUT assumptions. And I am finished with it. Other grids seem to be able to make it all work without gouging their members, and they do it for FREE... Check out OpenSim and the HyperGrid. Charity? I think not.
ReplyDeleteI love phoenix. Never the less I had problems with the last viewer it took out some of L's and now I'm afraid to upgrade to the lastest viewer. .A viewer that maybe hopefully could kill the lag on sl. I wished that the newer viewer wouldn't be "taking" any of my L's.I've tried firestorm before and it was so odd to have the radio and voulume button up on top the screen where as with phoenix I'm so use to having everything at the bottom.
ReplyDeleteFriend Caoilte, I shall be very pleased if you get happy there.
ReplyDeleteSo waiting for the Phoenix Mesh, quite frankly I cannot see how any person could ever be comfortable with ANY viewer based on the Viewer 2 style... it's absolute garbage.. yeah i am sure Firestorm is leaps and bounds ahead of Viewer 2 but the over all layout is similiar and just as clunky.. Phoenix forever!
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